Wednesday, April 1, 2009

Winter Dreams Fishbowl

Hello and welcome to the first Fishbowl of the Second Semester!

A Few Reminders:
-The outer circle is expected to partcipate at least five times on the Live Blog discussion.
-Hit F5 to refresh the blog.
-Respond to individual's specific questions. Do NOT leave random comments.
-The hot seats are avaliable for your participation in the inner circle...if you have a comment please get up and add it to the discussion!

97 comments:

PatrickD said...

;')

Andrew L said...

Jordon i do not agree because although dexter was in love with her they both went there seperat ways so the love story was ruined.

Andrew L said...

i agree with patrick

carlys said...

To answer the question if this was a good love story, i do not think it was. Judy had more love for herself and the attention of others then love FOR others. For a love story to occur, both people have to feel the same way.

ErinH said...

I don't think that this is a good love story. Dexter and Julia didn't have the connection that makes a good love story.

PatrickD said...

hahaha thanks andrew!

Eva H said...

Was anyone completely outraged at Judy and her actions, and Dexter always making the same mistake in trusting her? And some of the writing was dificult to understand. I sometimes didn't know what the emotions were.

hilary l said...

I think that it was not a very good love story. I like love stories that have good endings and I feel that they didnt have a really good ending where they were together and happy. There was love in the story but her never got to really enjoy that love.

Brianne D. said...

I think there was love in the story but I don't think it was a good love story. I didn't like how Judy would play with his heart and tell him he loved him but never settle down with him. Dexter was hurt the whole story because Judy was always with a new guy.

jenniferc said...

it was still a love story. Because before they split was love.

PatrickD said...

i also agree with the whole not a love story staitment there was love there but it was not a good love story and stuff...

sarahm said...

i believe in lust at first sight, and being attracted to someone when you first see them, but to be in love and have love with another person, you have to learn things about them, and spend time with them. know who they are, and love them for it.

MattB said...

I agree with Carly because i thought that Judy was too in love with herself instead of loving Dexter. I also dont think this was a love story because they didnt end up together and usually in these kind of stories they stay together.

Ciara S. said...

i dont think it was a good love story either because like andrew said they did end up going there seperate ways. and how dexter decided to go off on his own just kinda ruined the story.

jenniferc said...

I agree with hilary, i do think it was a love story just not a very good one. Because of the fact that the love didnt work out.

Andrew L said...

anytime patrick.

also i agree with erin there was no real connection between them i personaly think he thought he was in love with her but really he was not. he just could not let go cuz he loved the feeling of being with her because he had never felt that before but it was actually not love.

hilary l said...

I think it was more lust instead of love between Judy and Dexter. He was addicted to wanting her want him and she was addicted to wanting every guy want her and that was all it may have been.

ErinH said...

Eva- I think that the Judy was shallow. She was so focused on the wealth of a person that she lost focus and didn't see Dexter who was infront of her.

Brianne D. said...

To respond to Eva's question I was totally outraged by Judy's actions. So many guys including Dexter fell in love with her and she just went from guy to guy not caring about anyones emotions and hearts.

kendlet said...

i believe in butterflies, and liking someone so much that you could melt, but i don't know how you can love someone without being their best friend, eventually. Mabe love can be seen at first sight, and then that person can fall more in love. Movies make it seem that way, i don't know anyone who that's happend too. if that makes sense=]

Barry Tischler said...

what kind of a love story is it when the two main charachters never get to be together, grow completely apart, and never see each other again.

MattB said...

I agree with what Andrew said because it seemed like Dexter thought he was in love with Judy but he may have just been interested in her at the time and she didnt love him back like he thought he loved her.

Brianne D. said...

Do you guys believe in love at first sight?

sarahm said...

i like what maggie said about loving someone in different ways. everyone has a special way they give and recieve love. their own love language.

kendlet said...

trust is a huge factor in love, and like Eva said, when that's broken how can you not be upset, how can you love that person as much as you did before it was broken

Lynch G said...

I think that the winter dreams story was very simular to Zelda and Scott's love story

Barry Tischler said...

What exactly were the "winter dreams", and why would Fitzgerald name his story that if he mentions them only twice.

jenniferc said...

I personaly dont know if it was true love like some people are saying. Like andrew said maybe is wasn't so much love but more so lust, just wanting to be with her because he wants to be with her.

Andrew L said...

i agree with glen they were both not very good

ErinH said...

I don't think that they fell in love at first sight. Yeah he thought that she was pretty but I think he was put off by her actions. I mean i would be put off by someone who was hitting their nanny.

Lynch G said...

Winter dreams was like what he thought of Sara I thought

tharrell said...

I agree with Jordan on the connection dexter had with judy jones was stronger than zelda and his marraige but i thought winter dreams was depressing and not a love story cuz they never really got to explore their love really

ErinH said...

What are the winter dreams?

JohnS said...

I agree with Eva, I think that it was un fair to Dexter, and I also agree with Brianne, he loved her and she still went out with so many guys, But in the end it was still a love story, just not a normal one.

Niki_Huck said...

Eva I totally agree with the fact that Judy was rude and mean to Dexter. Like in the begining of the story it tells of how Judy thought she was better than Dexter.

Barry Tischler said...

there is a difference between love and infatuation. You can't really love someone who manipulates you the way judy did, but one might be infatuated with her beauty

hilary l said...

I think Dexter knew from the beginning that Judy was not a good person for him to fall in love with. I also think he knew that she would break her heart because she was able to get guys to fall in love with her and then she would dump them and show no emotion about it. She had too many guys and she wanted them to all want her...she didn't really care about showing love back to those men. She would lead them on and use them.

kendlet said...

To Barry's comment, i get what your saying about this story but i think that if you have true love, you can be apart for a long time with out growing apart. i dunno

MattB said...

I agree with Glenn because i also think that this was based on zelda and fitzgerald's own "love story", i think that some of his depressing experiences with zelda had a huge impact on his writing, especially in this story.

Niki_Huck said...

I think that Judy and Dexter had a love for each other but there were factors such as Judy's love for attention that got in between there love

Lynch G said...

I disagree with Erin. I think Dexter fell in love right at first because of the description that he gave about Sara in the very start when he was a little boy

PatrickD said...

true love is a trap and once your in the trap your stuck forever.

Ciara S. said...

Brianne- i dont really think that there is "love" at first sight. I think that there can be lust but in order to be in love i think that you have to really get to know the person. i dont think that you can just see a person and be like oh my gosh i'm in love with him.

tharrell said...

haha i agree with Eva! I dont think it was really love at first sight i think it was attraction cuz if he really loved her he would caddy for her. Just like when you see a beautiful person on the street you may be like oo but then their actions say otherwise and i would to be put off my her hitting her nanny

Ciara S. said...

Do you think that dexter was kind of clingy?

Eva H said...

I used to believe at love at frist sight but I don't anymore. Ok. We have established that there was love, but it wasn't true love. According to the romantics true love lasts a life time and if I'm not mistaken, Dexter didn't want to be with Judy when her beauty faded. Judy didn't love him because she didn't know what love was. She had affairs. Relationship and comittment are probably not in her vocabulary. Judy and Dexter's story wasn't a love story. It was a lust story. And Fitzgerald and Zelda did have love, and it was one heck of a story but it sure wasn't a good one.

Lynch G said...

What did you guys think of this story I personally thought it was really boring and was disapointed with the lack of action....:(

Barry Tischler said...

sort of along the lines of what Niki said, Judy didn't really love Dexter. She more loved the fact that someone loved HER.

MattB said...

I also agree with what Erin said about this not being love at first sight. It seemed like Dexter just wanted to get with Judy and Judy just wanted any guy and didnt really treat them very well, i dont think that Dex loved her but i think he had lust for her, like someone said earlier..

kendlet said...

i agree with jen

Andrew L said...

i agree with sarah in the inner circle that in the end dexter did not want to hurt irene like how judy had hurt him. so he just decided to not choose anyone

tharrell said...

Carly S- I agree with you! I think its just attraction and lust the love part comes when you get to know them cuz the getting to know them part is part makes relationships grow!

JohnS said...

I agree with Berry and Erin, the name Winter Dreams doesn't fit the story, could Dexters hope of being with her just a dream because it would never happen or work, and winter because she is cold and hurts a lot of people?

normao said...

I agree with Eva, because honestly how can you fall in love with you just one look, your falling in love with their looks, not of who they are because you can't see who they are at first sight.

Niki_Huck said...

I feel as if this story is based on how Zelda treated Fitzgerald. How she would only marry him after he wrote a book and became succesful.

MattB said...

To go off what Keri said in the fishbowl, i would not take someone back if they hurt me the way Judy did to Dexter, it would be hard to love someone again after they did something that bad to you.

Ciara S. said...

i agree with eva that it was more of an attraction than it was love. because like trisha said if he did love her he would of caddied for her. he might of fallen head over heels for her but i dont think that it was love at first sight.

carlys said...

I believe in love at first sight. However, circumstances affect the outcome of the relationship. If the love is more then attraction and physical, I think that people are willing to make possible problems work.

Brianne D. said...

I think that Dexter and Fitzgerald are similar because they both were going after pretty girls that all the guys wanted as well. They both got their heartbroken, but Fitzgerald eventually got his girl even though it didn't end up to good.

Eva H said...

I think the winter dreams were the dreams that dexter had about loving Judy and being with her during the summer. And then when life moved on and he realized his mistakes in believing her and he had heard that her beauty had gone, those dreams died.

kendlet said...

haha how is true love a trap?

Barry Tischler said...

The whole "winter dreams" thing almost has nothing to do with the story it all. One could force a connection to Judy's cold love, but odds are that may have nothing to do with the name at all.

ErinH said...

I agree with barry. But i think that this infatuation instead of love. I feel as if they had gotten married the fire would have ended in a year and then judy would have left

jenniferc said...

Glen, i personally did not enjoy this story. I had problems keeping my self from falling asleep while reading this. I did not follow it very well.

JohnS said...

I agree with the lust argument, i think her beutie blinded him and just the want to be with her is the reason why he still loved her.

PatrickD said...

i dont belive in love at first sight i belive in attraction at first sight. you can instantly be attracted to somone but how do you love somone if you know nothing about them?

sarahm said...

Pat- i love what you said about true love being a trap. once your caught, your caught for life. i believe it is both a blessing and a burden to be in love. nothing is ever the same...

tharrell said...

I think that could be possible with Irene representing that girl he had an affair with in Hollywood because the way he cared for her but didnt really love her and Judy was like Zelda in matching characteristics.

Nacarid said...

I don't think it was a good love story because they didn't have a real connection. Judy was too in love with herself and she just wanted to have fun, and Dexter wanted something that will last forever. And I think Judy thought that Dexter was always was going to be there for her, but when he was not she wanted it, people always want what they don't have.

normao said...

I disagree with Matt because yes that person hurt you, but if you really love someone you would want to go back to them no matter what, its like a power of loving someone, you'll still love them with all the mistakes they've made even if at one point that mistake was hurting you...

kendlet said...

Thank YOU sarah! that makes sense

JohnS said...

I agree with Jen, this was a hard story to fallow and the ending was weired, i just didnt like it

Ciara S. said...

glen- i thought the story was hard to read because it didn't keep your attention. so i also found it hard to read and boring.

Brianne D. said...

Even though I didn't care about Judy and her actions I still felt bad for her when she got married because she was so mistreated and disrespected by her husband. And she was only 27 and people we talking about how much she had changed with her beauty and all.

Andrew L said...

jen i fell alseep too hahah

hilary l said...

I think if I loved someone that much but if it was a relationship where only I was doing that giving and I was the only person who is loving and the other isn't really putting anything into the relationship then I would try my hardest to get over that person and move on becuase it makes it so much harder when only one person is trying to make the relationship work. I think that I would find another guy that would give that love back to me who I would love just as much. There is too much hurt in a relationship like that and it isn't worth trying to make it work. It might take a long time to get over that person but it will be worth it when you find someone who loves you back.

Niki_Huck said...

I really like what malory said about how Judy and Dexter are both parts of Fitzgeralds personality. Fitzgerald can be the lovable nice guy but he has a dark side when he drinks and parties

Barry Tischler said...

"Love at first sight", and true love and all of these kinds of expressions are all based on the defintion of love, which being an abstract concept and therefore fluid doesn't really have a definition. We really have no way to decide upon true love, love at first sight, or anything else until we establish the difference between love and attraction.

ErinH said...

Did Judy deserve to get a husband that didn't truely love her

tharrell said...

Winter Dreams title:
I thought the title didnt connect very well but i dont know it seemed to me that his feelings were connected to the seasons and each season was a different stage of love or different form either growing or declining. Thats what i thought

JohnS said...

I disagree with Norma, its not like she hurt him once, it was over years that he loved her and wanted her

Ciara S. said...

weren't F. Scott fitzgerald and zelda only three years apart in age just like dexter and judy where in the story?

kendlet said...

i didn't like this story either,it was really confuzing and slow, which makes it hard to justify if it was true love or not.

carlys said...

I love what you said Sarah. When you fall in love, you can't help it, and if you accept it you have to accept the "unhappy" qualities. I think love over powers the flaws in another person and sometimes blindsights you on reality.

Eva H said...

I have to say, that talking about love makes my head hurt. When it comes down to it, how many of us have experienced true, honest love? In your own word, what is love anyway?

JohnS said...

Sarah, thats was deep

tharrell said...

Erin i think she did because its her past coming to bit her in the butt. I think she deserved because she passed up all the other good opportunities she had

Barry Tischler said...

Trisha:

Dexter had a stupid infatuation with Judy through all four seasons, so again title desn't really fit anything. you could make the connection, but it is still really iffy, and I for one don't like trying to put my words in the mouth of an author i dont even know

PatrickD said...

Berry - i dont agree with what you said i think everybody has an idea of true love and i sure that some have witnessed true love the love at first sight i believe is a dream i dont feel it is a real thing.

carlys said...

Erin- i think that Judy's outcome was karma. She went through life without any consequences for her actions. She was given to her what she did to so many people. Im not saying she deserved, im saying it was karma.

Nacarid said...

I don't think it was love because if they both wanted it they would fought for it and they would made it work. I think they just love to play the game.

kendlet said...

i fully agree with Pat, everyone has it different, in away it's like, how can you judge someone else'e love?

hilary l said...

I agree with Carly, I think it was karma as well.

normao said...

I agree with Nacarid, so its kinda wasn't a love story then?

Barry Tischler said...

Pat, your confusing what I said. I was saying that the concept of "love" is fluid and each person does have their own definition. these multiple definitions bias the observations of the things we like to call "true love" and the like.

Eva H said...

I personally didn't enjoy this story. I disliked the main characters and their words and actions. This was not one of my personal favorties. And so far, F. Scott Fitzgerald hasn't captured my attention.

Allison M. said...

I guess I don't agree with what everyone is saying about "a love story". I mean just because two people don't end up together doesn't mean it isn't a love story. It may not end up like we all want it to, but the fact is that Dexter was in love with Judy. However, she was just one of those girls who cannot commit to one thing. She likes the attention from guys. It really reminds me of Fitzgerald and Zelda. He loved her, but she just wasn't the kind of girl to settle down. She liked to stray away from him. However, I do agree with everyone that it was wrong of Judy to toy with Dexter's emotions.